And there are Americans who went before us who were as smart or smarter, as funny or funnier, more nimble, more interesting, more capable, and who saved us from this last time around, and we should learn how they did it. You can see more of our work, including links to things we mentioned here, by going to nbcnews.com/whyisthishappening.Stream the video version of this conversation on Peacock here. Up w/ Chris Hayes: Are we in an era of post-truth politics? Chris Hayes: Exactly. Chris Hayes: And all that nasty unseemliness in '39 and '40 --, Rachel Maddow: We beat them. Chris Hayes: Well, so let's talk about before we get to the podcast --. The ReidOut. Rachel Maddow: And I'm really grateful. And I was like, I feel like I would know if that happened. Chris Hayes: And that's something that comes through in the story you're telling in a way that, I think, we really don't think enough about. And the thing that I thought was beautiful about this is that, at the end of this whole thing, exposing the Christian Front and talking about how theyre essentially --. I mean, one of the things that's sort of really exciting and fascinating about the podcast is you've got front-page news coverage of this stuff. Harriet Johnson, I only took out in the draft before you got that rough cut, so --, Chris Hayes: Right, because you didn't want to give me two names that I had to manage --. Rachel Maddow: -- stockpiling bombs and detailed plans. The 11th Hour with Stephanie . See or download fact-checks by FactCheck.org, PolitiFact, and The Washington Post's Fact Checker.The Nancy Pelosi Archive is one of several collections of TV news clips featuring public officials, with related fact-checks. Chris Hayes: I am someone who does this for a living. You made me meet me half the feelings. I'm not pulling this from memory. I can keep doing what I'm doing. Rachel Maddow: Theres no such thing as todays Father Coughlin. Rachel Maddow: I love that, but it takes a lot of work. Mark Henle - The Arizona Republic - Pool / AP, Richard Pohle - Pool - AFP / Getty Images, @bennyjohnson / Twitter screen shot; Kamil Krzaczynski / Getty Images, Svet foto / Shutterstock; @FoxNews / Twitter. Is this a real story? Chris Hayes is an American political commentator, television news anchor, and author. As threats to American democracy abound, theres more that has to be done to save it, said Maddow in our exclusive podcast interview. Chris Hayes: Pearl Harbor happens, the war happens. Rachel Maddow: You can express them, and you can --. One of her new projects is "Rachel Maddow Presents: Ultra," a podcast all about the history of pre-World-War-two American fascism, and those who worked to stop it. Culture Rachel Maddow Coronavirus MSNBC TV. Rachel Maddow: And so, I am working past midnight now instead of stopping working at --. Dog whistle, much? I mean, obviously it's your voice, and you have a very good voice technically, but a Rachel Maddow way of telling a story that happens in this podcast where it's like, "I'm in it. I want people to listen. Rachel Maddow: Thanks for being so nice. Chris Hayes is . We love your feedback, so tweet us the hashtag #WITHpod, e-mail WITHpod@gmail.com. They orchestrated civil lawsuits between different pro-fascist groups suing each other in order to expose all their dirty laundry to the world because law enforcement didnt care, right? Chris Hayes: But, like, where everyone was on Hitler and Nazis in '39, '40s, I guess, what I'm saying, is like a very different thing than where everyone is on Hitler and Nazis in '44. It kind of worked and he kind of broke it up. The combination of those things is something that the Justice Department tried to tackle through a mass sedition trial in 1944. Not clear that you could, really not clear. Rachel Maddow: Yeah. Chris Hayes: Wait, what's the story? Now, this is basically the standard for American League home run leaders for like the entirety of the first 20 years of the 20th century. Chris Hayes: Yes, but the opening scene of this podcast, you're just, like, I don't know who this guy is. So I hadn't gotten the actual cuts of the first two episodes. And its a speech --. And then everyone starts doing it differently or some people try to do it differently, even if they're not quite as good. Chris Hayes: Its a real shoot the Moon strategy. You also agree to our. Rachel Maddow: But also, power corrupts, right? You can have fascist feelings. ", Rich Polk / Getty Images for Politicon; Scott Olson / Getty Images. They've arrested these guys and put them on trial for sedition because they were stockpiling bombs and working with stolen military heavy machine guns, and they had a plot to simultaneously assassinate 12 members of Congress and violently attack armories and U.S. government outposts and take over the U.S. government, 80 years to the day from the Christian Front to the Oath Keepers sedition arrest. Is that a story about, you know, how populism and fascism and accountability can crash in ways that are very troubling in terms of the actions of the Justice Department? Maddow is best known for hosting MSNBC's The Rachel Maddow Show.She is known . . The political commentator Chris was born on February 28, 1979. Last week, Maddow confirmed reports that she planned. I mean, I brought this for you as a present. These are ones we are paying, and he publishes it and gets fired from the Justice Department for doing it. Chris Hayes: Yeah, exactly. You're so good at suspense, so good. Rachel Maddow: I was going to say, we're going to get a call from Mr. Stern, yeah. Search us up on TikTok by searching for WITHpod. Rachel Maddow: -- answer whatever e-mails I need to answer that pertain to this evening, and then shutoff and not turn on again until the workday starts again. Hey, mom, yeah, but I did. (L-R) Alex Wagner and Rachel Maddow Patrick Randak/MSNBC/Getty Images. Rachel Maddow: Oh, in terms of legitimately not knowing what's coming next? Rachel Maddow: Yeah. I communicate for a living. Rachel Maddow: And he's calling for Christians to boycott Jewish businesses and saying that America, he, as Father Coughlin, takes the path of fascism. Rachel Maddow: Right. And then it's here. But the thing that was very exciting to me about that was like, oh, well, let's see what Babe Ruth is going to do next. So to me, that's like the thing that I feel like I brought to this job that I've tried to hold on to and tried to build on, which is people are capable of absorbing any level of complexity and even obscurity if you do the work to get them there. Rachel Maddow: And also, is this real? And that was part of what was hard about drafting the podcast because you could do the whole thing on Coughlin and the Christian Front, right? I mean --, Chris Hayes: -- and through time, I mean, I think thats also partly, in a weird way theres actually kind of something comforting about it insofar as a liberal democratic open society is going to face existential foes to that liberalism almost as a matter of just reality. Um Why is there a swastika behind you on the desk, Chris? Politics, Foreign Policy, Military & Defense Issues. And Rachel is just on another level as a communicator and a storyteller, and incredibly innovative in that respect as well, just at a technical level, which I think we're going to talk about a little bit, even though it's like a little inside (ph). That happened. And hes very, you know, honest about the fact that antisemitism was not a sin in the Catholic church --. Chris Hayes is an American political commentator, journalist, podcaster, producer, and author who has a net worth of $6 million. Rachel Maddow: That makes for a good booze ballad. Multiple outlets have reported over the last few weeks that Chris Hayes is going to be canceled, but the story has taken a new turn with sources inside MSNBC saying that Rachel Maddow will be . His full name is Christopher Loffredo. The 8 p.m. MSNBC show hosted by Chris Hayes averaged a 1.4 rating in June, down slightly from a 1.5 in May. You know what I mean? See, if I was not televisual, I could be like in 1913, the American League home run leader was a guy named Home Run Baker. As a bonus for "The Rachel Maddow Show" listeners, Rachel joins Chris Hayes on "Why Is This Happening? Chris Hayes: Howard Stern, yeah. Oct. 12, 2022, 3:29 PM PDT By Why Is This. And then in 1913, he had 12. Chris Hayes: That, like, a lot of times you come in, you're talking to a spouse or a friend or a therapist, and you're, like, talking about things in your life. Rachel Maddow: -- your story and learn it. To be like, "Thank you. In this case, this pamphlet is about the Bronx. And the same agents in the Hitler government, operating through the same channels, was doing both of those things simultaneously. Hayes and Shaw now resided in Washington, D.C. Chris Hayes: -- but that creates this constant sense of curiosity. It's like, yeah, my job does this, but then there's you, inside. Thats like hes a multiple of the Super Bowl every week in terms of --. Great reason --. What's the story? And the Justice Department was like, "We should do something about this. And then the prosecutor said they continued their plot. Do you remember what it was like? Chris Hayes: -- because I only had one, and that one was enough. Rachel Maddow: Yes. And a lot of the most fascist stuff comes from what it gets in the room. Rachel Maddow: Dont tell anybody though. . Chris Hayes: I've never heard of this guy. Quiz: Photo of Rachel Maddow or Photo of Chris Hayes? Rachel Maddow: -- sort of a bit player in this story and theyre actually supported by the Hitler government. Trump staffers scooping up little red swastika golf balls into Make America Great Again hats is the tableau of the campaign so far, Hayes said in 2016, Starnes noted. Hes a big enough deal that had he decided to leave the priesthood and run for office and hes --. I just think we need some energy in it, and Im hoping, in some ways, that learning the history of other Americans who have done it well can give us some energy. We are in utterly uncharted territory." Ai. Chris Hayes: -- like, how is the new life of one night a week of "The Rachel Maddow Show"? Dog whistle, much? one Twitter user posted, while another wrote, Whats this? in bafflement. Chris Hayes: -- you play the Coughlin, its like even if it was in a language I can understand, I'm (ph) like, I think I know probably what hes ranting about. I think there needs to be a bigger, broader, anti-fascist movement where people actually have work to do every day in trying to fight fascism and save the country, she urged. Practical steps for Americans reading this who are concerned about this. According to the Daily Beast, Maddow's new contract would allow her more. And so, we had to decide whether or not this was the enemy within. Chris Hayes: "I think the future is unwritten, and anyone who tells you they know what's going to happen is wrong. Chris Hayes (@chrislhayes) October 5, 2022 "Just so incredibly perfect that I have a typo in this tweet. As of 2021, Chris Hayes has a net worth of $5 million. One of the defendants wrote a book about it. But this highly. Similarly, with the great sedition trial in 1944, which is sort of amazing that they brought it in 1944 --, Chris Hayes: Right, yes, right, right, right --, Rachel Maddow: -- given what happened in 1940 when they tried it against the Christian Front, that trial has gone down in history as a failure or as a sideshow or, in some cases, as a debacle because it wasn't a successful prosecution. Chris Hayes: But thats why, to me, your focus here on the sort of civic antibodies are so key, right? And like, you get figures like this sometimes, right? I feel like this idea that we're dealing with pro-authoritarian impulses on the right as connected to electoral politics, that being some sort of unprecedented challenge, it doesn't feel unprecedented to me. Search us for WITHpod. Rachel Maddow: -- 10:30. Rachel Maddow: -- who are beating up Jews in neighborhoods in New York. He gets on the air in the United States just after Kristallnacht, and basically says, yeah, the Jews had it coming. But I find it really interesting, so you're along for the ride. Chris Hayes: And, yes, I think it's a really important thing that I've learned also, like if someone sends an e-mail or sends a note saying, like, the thing you said in the monologue this morning when you were just talking it through, like, isn't quite right, you kind of missed this. Rachel Maddow: I found my way to the story a little bit backwards. Rachel Maddow: Yeah, yeah, and then he got a five-year prison sentence. I think that our professional, and civic and religious institutions can be strong, but can also be hurt. Rachel Maddow: Its a big swing the Justice Department is taking in this case. Similarly, his birthplace is Norwood, Bronx. A Goodwill branch has, too. It's an hour --, Chris Hayes: And it's this thing. Rachel Maddow: And where we get to from that is a Nazi plot --. She writes her first lady column about how shocked she is. Chris Hayes: Who figures prominently in the podcast. And also the theology around tyranny and sedition, being a nuanced thing that Coughlin was very cognizant of and was playing with, even as his followers were being put on trial for sedition for having them what he told them to do. Today, Rachel Maddow writes about the future of election integrity. And as such, your failed plot is a failed plot and can be minimized as unserious --, Rachel Maddow: -- and unthreatening. The subject of the. Rachel Maddow: Theyre running, literally, Hitler youth summer camps --. Rachel Maddow: -- to distribute German government propaganda in the United States through the U.S. Congress and through the United States Senate. Jon Stewart enters the game - In light of the influence Jon Stewart had in encouraging the passage of the 9/11 first responders bill, The Rachel Maddow Show replays a portion of his interview with Rachel Maddow in which he discusses whether he's a player or spectator in the game of politics. So I took out the name of the senator's secretary after leaving it in for all the other drafts. And one of the plots that we talk about in the podcast involves a guy who had been, you know, a high-ranking clan leader, right. Rachel Maddow: James Comey, right? The 34-year-old anchor of Up, MSNBC's 8 a.m. weekend show, invited 15 friends to his one-bedroom apartment in Manhattan's East Village. I mean, they were in control but also profoundly corrupt. 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